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Followup: Masochism, Pain Or Abuse?

Wow, this has turned out to be so much more interesting as a thread than I expected. I kinda wanted to keep my own opinions out of it, since I was the one judged as not understanding, but there’s a few points I feel I should answer and clarify from my own point of view…

Firstly, re; the mail itself:

Do I agree that someone who is ‘anti-pain’ and not having a good time should be able to stop a scene immediately? Yes I do. The points I disagreed with were as follows:

Please reflect fully on the effect of pain when someone is in the anti-pain state of mind (not masochistic). It is the infinite opposite of S&M and masochistic pleasure. Pain must NEVER be delivered when they are in this state of mind. Reflect fully on all the times you’ve done this on your site.

Reflection done – can’t think of an occassion that applies TBH. We hire masochists. Where it has turned out the scene as planned was not working for someone we have stopped and renegotiated something that suited them better. Most of the heaviest scenes were scripted by the girls themselves as things they wanted to try.

In the masochistic state of mind, a person:
– Never flinches away from the pain, but wants and moves towards it
– Never, ever cries from the pain, but moans in pleasure

I disagree strongly. This is true for some people – it is in no way a definition. People react differently to different stimuli, and people enjoy themselves in different ways. Personally, I have enough respect for women (and people in general) to believe they can make up their own minds and communicate what they want without me having to interpret it through my own reality filter.

If any doubt you must always check which of the 2 infinitely opposite states of mind the person is before any pain is given or continues. If they enter the anti-pain state of mind, all pain must stop immediately. Anything else is the opposite of S&M, and criminal and abusive.

I agree…

You’ve done this too many times on your site. Reflect on that suffering, not pleasure, as if it was being inflicted upon you while you are in the anti-pain, non-masocistic state of mind exclusively. Just reflect.

Ummm… no I haven’t

I don’t know if the original author will accept my invitation to read this thread, but if so, please read the comments and reflect.


Plus they don’t seem to realise that your running a business and if your models suddenly decide ‘Oh I am not in a masochistic state of mind’ well thats no good at all when you have booked a crew and studio. I do CP stuff and sometimes I think I am not in the right headspace, but you find it or deal with it. Thats the responsibility of the model.

Thank you for your support, but wanted to comment on this particular point from my own ethical point of view.

Actually, while I’m sure you are right for many companies that’s not how I work. If someone is not happy during a scene they agreed to in advance, I will stop and re-negotiate. I pay for publication rights rather than levels, and the girls work to the levels they want to go to. I couldn’t live with myself if I thought anyone was going through some of the heavier scenes we shoot ‘for money’ or ‘because they agreed to’.

While it is expensive, and a huge pain in the ass, if we have to pull a shoot early, or change plans dramatically, I would always do that (and often have) before pressuring anyone to handle being beaten and tortured as ‘a job’